Please pardon my getting personal here; I generally avoid bringing emotions to logic-based discussions, but I noticed that this one, here, is nauseating me:
It was my wife you’re talking about, and it was to be our fourth child. the child was not viable, and it would have been sheer around-the-clock torture for my wife to carry our fourth…
Please pardon my getting personal here; I generally avoid bringing emotions to logic-based discussions, but I noticed that this one, here, is nauseating me:
It was my wife you’re talking about, and it was to be our fourth child. the child was not viable, and it would have been sheer around-the-clock torture for my wife to carry our fourth child to term, at which time, God might or might not have finalized the process. Our long-time Catholic OB/GYN referred us to a non-opposed doctor. The hospital staff, especially its profoundly sympathetic nurse, who treated us as in our other pregnancies/births, was an incredible relief—given the tragedy that we were forced—arguably by God—to endure. Our final fifth or fourth child was born in excellent health and form, a year later.
I recognize a shift of topics, that seeks to treat abortion as if it is ever—ever—independent of a mother, in an active state of pregnancy—regardless whether she is a profligate harlot who may use abortion as a contraceptive—or all the other thousands of mothers, everywhere, in every condition and circumstance, who miscarries or still-births or must terminate for any number of medical/pregnancy conditions.
The preceding sentence may have grown inchoate. All who argue—not against their own potential abortions, but against those of others—speak as if the mother involved lacks Standing.
But, of course, she has Standing. She has it in the highest, primary form. I realize that Anti-Abortion (AKA euphemized as “Pro-Life”) persons, are either limited in the range of their thinking, or are else of the Nurse Ratchett variety of thinkers and feelers: those who lack genuine concern for the health and well-being of others.
Twenty-first Century America ought not to be a contemporary version of Salem, Massachusetts, witch-hunts. No American practice of religion allows Me to intercede in Your determination to sin—if sin, these medical procedures be. No conscientious, Constitution-loving American, can support the kinds of evil invasions of privacy—including legislated vigilantes and cross-state-line-incriminating laws.
The Anti-Abortion folks are either inadequate thinkers or else meddling torturers. I can not imagine using abortion as a means of birth control. We dearly love each of our four children. For you or Justice Alito or anyone else to get in the way of our health and safety—and medical privacy—in this way, is an evil far greater than even Christ would allow any of us, to judge an aborting mother on His behalf.
So my wife and I were in the same boat as you about 20 years ago. We had a child with a fatal birth defect that was detected by sonogram. We elected to NOT have an abortion and it was a good decision even though our child died because that way we got to spend time, however short, with our child. But that was our decision, our choice. You and your wife made a different choice, but it is your choice to make.
Thank you, that was poignant, what a difficult thing to go through, and my heart goes out to you and your family. Not sure how I would have met that test. My wife’s birthing was relatively easy for our three. What you talk about there near the end is one, if not the biggest thing, about those who wish to make no exceptions that infuriates me. How dare they? It makes me conclude that they really don’t care about human life, they are just checking a box. Harsh perhaps, but I don’t know else how to comprehend it. Bottom line to me: it is a fundamental breakdown in human compassion. That is distinctly unlike the teachings of Christ. And he is the one we should be trying to follow.
If we, too, had stopped at three, we would still have supported any woman’s right to make her own medical decisions. But our daughter desperately wanted a younger brother, and we did our best so provide. Was it God who temporarily got in the way?
Regardless, we learned first-hand, not only that indiscriminate obstruction to terminate the death-sentence pregnancy would have been horrific, torture, but also that tens of thousands of families go through the same thing—and right now, here in Texas, God spare them!
You and I surely share a prayer, that not one single woman more must go through the Hell of a defective pregnancy or miscarriage.
I’m not one to intercede between any person and God. To do this is so clearly a sin, I can’t help but question the true motivations of all who so-dispassionately stand in the way. And as I say elsewhere in this whole set of comments, my ability to remain calmly courteous is now frayed.
It’s my wife, and could have been your wife, these people are talking about. I apologize again—to you and anyone else my expressions impose on:
To unequivocally oppose abortion for others, unless you practice Christian Science yourself, and abjure all medical science, is Wrong.
And, I should add, I’m not hard over that Christianity is the only way, it’s just that Jesus is the teacher that I have identified with the most in my life…
Please pardon my getting personal here; I generally avoid bringing emotions to logic-based discussions, but I noticed that this one, here, is nauseating me:
It was my wife you’re talking about, and it was to be our fourth child. the child was not viable, and it would have been sheer around-the-clock torture for my wife to carry our fourth child to term, at which time, God might or might not have finalized the process. Our long-time Catholic OB/GYN referred us to a non-opposed doctor. The hospital staff, especially its profoundly sympathetic nurse, who treated us as in our other pregnancies/births, was an incredible relief—given the tragedy that we were forced—arguably by God—to endure. Our final fifth or fourth child was born in excellent health and form, a year later.
I recognize a shift of topics, that seeks to treat abortion as if it is ever—ever—independent of a mother, in an active state of pregnancy—regardless whether she is a profligate harlot who may use abortion as a contraceptive—or all the other thousands of mothers, everywhere, in every condition and circumstance, who miscarries or still-births or must terminate for any number of medical/pregnancy conditions.
The preceding sentence may have grown inchoate. All who argue—not against their own potential abortions, but against those of others—speak as if the mother involved lacks Standing.
But, of course, she has Standing. She has it in the highest, primary form. I realize that Anti-Abortion (AKA euphemized as “Pro-Life”) persons, are either limited in the range of their thinking, or are else of the Nurse Ratchett variety of thinkers and feelers: those who lack genuine concern for the health and well-being of others.
Twenty-first Century America ought not to be a contemporary version of Salem, Massachusetts, witch-hunts. No American practice of religion allows Me to intercede in Your determination to sin—if sin, these medical procedures be. No conscientious, Constitution-loving American, can support the kinds of evil invasions of privacy—including legislated vigilantes and cross-state-line-incriminating laws.
The Anti-Abortion folks are either inadequate thinkers or else meddling torturers. I can not imagine using abortion as a means of birth control. We dearly love each of our four children. For you or Justice Alito or anyone else to get in the way of our health and safety—and medical privacy—in this way, is an evil far greater than even Christ would allow any of us, to judge an aborting mother on His behalf.
So my wife and I were in the same boat as you about 20 years ago. We had a child with a fatal birth defect that was detected by sonogram. We elected to NOT have an abortion and it was a good decision even though our child died because that way we got to spend time, however short, with our child. But that was our decision, our choice. You and your wife made a different choice, but it is your choice to make.
Thank you, that was poignant, what a difficult thing to go through, and my heart goes out to you and your family. Not sure how I would have met that test. My wife’s birthing was relatively easy for our three. What you talk about there near the end is one, if not the biggest thing, about those who wish to make no exceptions that infuriates me. How dare they? It makes me conclude that they really don’t care about human life, they are just checking a box. Harsh perhaps, but I don’t know else how to comprehend it. Bottom line to me: it is a fundamental breakdown in human compassion. That is distinctly unlike the teachings of Christ. And he is the one we should be trying to follow.
If we, too, had stopped at three, we would still have supported any woman’s right to make her own medical decisions. But our daughter desperately wanted a younger brother, and we did our best so provide. Was it God who temporarily got in the way?
Regardless, we learned first-hand, not only that indiscriminate obstruction to terminate the death-sentence pregnancy would have been horrific, torture, but also that tens of thousands of families go through the same thing—and right now, here in Texas, God spare them!
You and I surely share a prayer, that not one single woman more must go through the Hell of a defective pregnancy or miscarriage.
I’m not one to intercede between any person and God. To do this is so clearly a sin, I can’t help but question the true motivations of all who so-dispassionately stand in the way. And as I say elsewhere in this whole set of comments, my ability to remain calmly courteous is now frayed.
It’s my wife, and could have been your wife, these people are talking about. I apologize again—to you and anyone else my expressions impose on:
To unequivocally oppose abortion for others, unless you practice Christian Science yourself, and abjure all medical science, is Wrong.
Saddest of Regards,
(($; -)}™
Gozo
And, I should add, I’m not hard over that Christianity is the only way, it’s just that Jesus is the teacher that I have identified with the most in my life…